Re: [-empyre-] see behind

> im starting to think life is too
> short to do things i dont really wanna do.. growing vegatables is starting
> to look much more fun than art making..

hi all,

I just come back from a hike in vosgian mountains in east of france. And  i
couldn't refrain me from thinking about melinda's final sentence.
One of the problems with web - an especially web3d - art, is to become
captive (in french that word is a synonym of fascinated...) of the strong
"aura" of screens.
I think while making growing vegetables, you will understand deeply your
interest in making ARTifice.
That trip in mountains makes me think we are not so far from landscape
architects. We have to install a globality, and then we have to think about
human perception of it.
Perhaps also we want to "see what is behind", like when you walk and pass
through mountains. Not in that ideal of transparency that characterize 80's
( a direct and frontal
transparency ) but in making the effort to discover "what is behind", giving
time to think about what we are going to see, to hybridize times and

Perhaps this is one definition of "media". Relay with delay beetween humans.
And in this direction, landscape, urbanity, vegetables and art are ones.

I can't believe you could stop making art, even if we can see nothing it
will be there.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Melinda Rackham" <>
To: "soft_skinned_space" <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2003 7:52 AM
Subject: Re: [-empyre-] games and apathy

> > and click."  i once had a viewer actually angry with me because the
> > piece i made *didn't* function like a web page. they were actually
> > angry! like it was some obligation of computer art to function like any
> > other piece of software, and that it was simply unacceptable for
> > computer art to ask its viewer to figure it out (it was then that i
> > began to really feel that this is all so hopeless).
> i am preturbed that gaming has put a massive degree of expectation onto
> users of and 3d art.. this is above and apart from the seamless, slick
> persectival production values that  john poited out wher e netart can't of
> course compete. firstly  i must admiit that  im not a net gamer , i got
> tired of typing kill kill kiil in moos, and i get bored in first person
> shooters after about 5 minutes, and with the myst series id raterh get the
> cheats than spend zillions of hours working  it out..,i dont wanna do the
> same thing again and again and again,...but i do like those arcade games
> shooters with guns you hold cause they are short.. i guess thats my
> generaltional thing slipping)
> the critcial issues is i think that the gaming and film industries, which
> are becoming increasibngly intertwined, puts an unconscious expectation of
> structure  into the minds of users.. there is a rhythm users are looking
> for, its the same as a movie rhythm..or a porn movie rhythm would be  a
> better example.. bit of talk - bit of sex-bit of talk-sex - talk-- etc.I
> noticed this adrenaline type rhythm really strongly the other week when i
> saw  xmen2   .. bit of talk -bit of action -bit of talk  etc ( i had the
> interresting experience of being  in a session  with  mostly 12 and 13
> olds who all talked , ran in and out of the theatre and answerd their
> mobiles in the non action narrative sequences) .. and that rhythm is
> pronounced in  games..  bit of exploring -bit of killing(or points
> bit of exploring..killing etc etc
>  so when you get to a piece of 3d net feel let down before you
> do anything with it.... this may be your problem tom@nullpointer.. .the
> expectation of the adrenaline hit isnt there, the primate body chemisrty
> peaks and troughs to hook you in havent happned.. i have had people say to
> me about my empyrean work.. "well whats the point" ..what are you supposed
> to do when you cant find obvious markers of reality or game play..
> "you mean your just supposed to look at it and think about it?? "
> "how can avatars communitce if there is no text input?"
> jesus that wants you to meditate on it.. !!
> how long are we supposeded to  engage a viewer for ? 30 seconds to 3
> minutes, 10 minutes?..what is the average time in front of a painting 20
> seconds..? yet we demand so so much from 3d art. its always in realtion to
> other media.. never valued by its intrinsic quatlities, never for
> roya was saying the 72dpi aesthetic is beautifull.  so is the lagged,
> polygony and uncertainly of 3d worlds.. and i think that only happens when
> we stop the comparisions ourselves.. when we stop trying to mimic other
> forms.. which is what i was trying to get at earlier in my  post about the
> frame...accept the parameters  and work with the subtlies within and
> them..
>  maybe as patrick licthy said in his dark night of the soul editorial at
> intelligent agent (jk : that scrolly thing had me confused for  while..:)
> are in the place where  net art in general is devalued..  and the
> is the important thing..  but i liek to think that in 20 years it wil have
> rennaissance.. just like video art is having at the moment..initially it
> didnt conform to cinematic expectations and when it was new it struggled
> then  it died in australia in any rate.. and now it is hot again..  with
> thsoe degreaded chunky video stills being traded in slick galleries..
> so i guess we are part of a larger fickle commodities inusdtry that trades
> on virtual trends and fashions... do we fit ourselves into that commodity
> market or do the epicurian stuff that we want to do. i guess the tricik is
> talking enough from both so you dont starve and get to do some of what you
> want....personally , and i dont know if its is the whole netart crisis of
> the moment or i am just finishing 4 yeras on a phd or i am  having a
> crisis,  i just have not made any plans for future work cause i dont want
> write apps because they might get funded.. im starting to think life is
> short to do things i dont really wanna do.. growing vegatables is starting
> to look much more fun than art making..
> melinda
> _______________________________________________
> empyre forum

This archive was generated by a fusion of Pipermail 0.09 (Mailman edition) and MHonArc 2.6.8.