[-empyre-] animation and gender

christopher sullivan csulli at saic.edu
Tue Mar 2 15:42:34 EST 2010 

mixing is good, and if you look at my other posts, I missspelled everyone. glad
you are in. Chris.

Quoting kim collmer <kcollmer at yahoo.com>:

> Thanks for including me, Chris, but somehow everyone misspells my name and
> luckily this time I can catch it! 
> Kim Collmer
> Though I must admit to mixing animation AND video...as stated in another
> post.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: christopher sullivan <csulli at saic.edu>
> To: soft_skinned_space <empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au>; Renate Ferro
> <rtf9 at cornell.edu>
> Cc: soft_skinned_space <empyre at gamera.cofa.unsw.edu.au>
> Sent: Mon, March 1, 2010 4:59:50 PM
> Subject: Re: [-empyre-] animation and gender
> 
> a couple more, Ruth Lingford, Wendy Tilby, Martha Colborn. Kim Colmer, Ariana
> Gerstine, Orla McHardy, Suzzy templeton, Laura Heit. Lisa Barcy, Susan Pit,
> Maureen Selwood, Christien Roche. got to go. Chris
> 
> 
> Quoting Renate Ferro <rtf9 at cornell.edu>:
> 
> > Dear all,
> > 
> > Chris thanks for the list of animators below.  There is something that I
> > have been very curious about since we began this whole discussion now
> > about a month ago.  I was on a site (and I'm not sure which one it was)
> > that was discussing the lack of female animators in the field.  The
> > distinction was that many female animators who are working tend to do more
> > documentary, self help animations.  Their observation was that most women
> > artists instead tended to be drawn towards manipulated, experimental
> > cinema and video and not straight animation. (Perhaps we need to extend
> > the whole notion of animation via the fuzziness that Suzanne alluded to
> > early on!) Additionally, Mary Flanagan was here at Cornell a few weeks ago
> > and in a public lecture commented on the overwhelming lack of female
> > gamers in the field as well.
> > 
> > Our next empyre discussion will not be beginning until March 8th so for
> > the next couple of days or so I'm hoping that we can all talk openly about
> >  this topic.  I"m fascinated and perhaps misinformed I hope.  Maybe the
> > tides are turning and many young female artists will be drawn into the new
> > technologies of animation.
> > 
> > When I first started looking for guests for this topic it was difficult to
> > find any women at all to participate but I'm so very happy that we finally
> > were able to get a great and yes diverse mix as Chris pointed out in one
> > of his last posts. Can you all send me your favorite female animators???
> > 
> > Renate
> > 
> > PS.  We will continue on for the next couple of days on animation and then
> > open things up for a few days of open conversation.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > Hi Richard, there are plenty of non-linear narrative animations, not too
> > > many
> > > feature ones, but then there are not all that many feature length
> > > animations.
> > > here are a few animators, off the top of my head, and the Quay's as well;
> > > janie
> > > Gieser. Lewis Klahr, Nancu Andrews, me Chris Sullivan, Jim Trainor, Simon
> > > Pummel, Amy Kravitze, Karen Yasinsky, Lilli Carre, Patrick Smith, Don
> > > Hertzfeld, Rose Bond, Joshua Mosely, Jim Duesing, Pritt Parn, Brent
> Green,
> > > Piotr Dumala, and check out the nice work funded by the organization,
> > > Animate
> > > Projects, great british wonders. have a good night. Chris.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Quoting Richard Wright <futurenatural at blueyonder.co.uk>:
> > >
> > >> I always liked the quality in the Quay films where time seems to lose
> > >> all its reference points. Those shots of dust settling or shadows
> > >> dancing where you are no longer sure whether you are watching in
> > >> "realtime" or over the course of hundreds of years.
> > >>
> > >> This also made me wonder why certain kinds of narrative and time are
> > >> almost never used in animation. For instance, why are there no non-
> > >> linear narrative animations? They are not that uncommon in live
> > >> action films - I am thinking of Memento that goes backwards in story
> > >> time (with one b/w stream going forwards), Amores Perros that jumps
> > >> repeatedly backwards and forwards, The Hours with its parallel
> > >> storylines running in different historical times periods. The only
> > >> example of an animated film that has anything like these kinds of
> > >> narrative structure is Waltz with Bashir with its persistent
> > >> flashbacks. And that was made by a live action director.
> > >>
> > >> I wonder if this has something to do with the way that animators
> > >> work, concentrating as they do on building up a sequence of actions
> > >> bit by bit, are they generally less directed towards the larger
> > >> narrative structures of time? By focusing on the duration of the
> > >> immediate event, is it as though they assume a sort of "short term
> > >> memory"?
> > >>
> > >> Richard
> > >>
> > >> On 25 Feb 2010, at 03:34, T Goodeve wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > Hello everyone:
> > >> >
> > >> > Sorry I’ve been so lax as a discussant-generator but here I am with
> > >> > some thoughts and reflections. If it’s okay just an aside first:
> > >> > off the top of my fingertips—many of you make stuff you love and
> > >> > live for, also write about with great passion, and the animated
> > >> > worldscape is still and ever will be one of magic and wonder I hope
> > >> > (you have the romantic here), i.e., endless visual and aural
> > >> > reimagings via its ability, or definition, whether anlogue or
> > >> > digital, to do anything and everything within and beyond the
> > >> > spacetime continuum. But sometimes I miss the basic humor, wonder,
> > >> > and sheer “wow” of the simplicity of animation. I mentioned in a
> > >> > post. The blank page and the dot. We lose track, myself included,
> > >> > analyzing the life out of things sometimes and to do this with
> > >> > animation seems particularly perverse. I realize I set myself up
> > >> > for a bit of ridicule here but alas, someone has to speak up for
> > >> > the puppet doll in Street of Crocodiles who cradles the bare light
> > >> > bulb baby in its arm and brings it back to life with light, or the
> > >> > frayed and earnest bunny who does his best to keep up with the
> > >> > spinning demented ping pong balls and a pair of disembodied knee
> > >> > socks and slippers moving up and down on tip toes in the Quays “Are
> > >> > We Still Married” —up and down, up and down. I think Christopher
> > >> > Sullivan was trying to get at this but not everyone is out to do
> > >> > what he does nor interested in the way I am or the Quays or for
> > >> > that matter, those who use it for visualization, but depending on
> > >> > why you do what you do we are here to discuss the breakthrough
> > >> > insights of theory and technology and animation, but it’s just
> > >> > sometimes I’ve felt we’ve let the technology get away with doing
> > >> > too much of the talking, not that it doesn’t have a lot to say.
> > >> >
> > >> > But a more hardy, if overly general, topic is temporality and time,
> > >> > now-time vs say the way cinema’s capturing, sculpting, control of
> > >> > time was such a huge part of its magic. Siegfried Kracauer describe
> > >> > in an essay how powerful just “having” the wind in the trees —a
> > >> > moment— captured on film is for him. How different from one of my
> > >> > students when I showed some film, perhaps Tarkovsky,” Why does he
> > >> > keep leaving the camera on the trees so long?” Students of cinema
> > >> > are different. We know this: ADD and short digitized attention
> > >> > spans. But how do you see this in your worlds of animation either
> > >> > in terms of resistance or something emerging that is part of this.
> > >> > One thing I thought was very relevant was the post of the shift
> > >> > tilt which is amazing and disturbing in this respect. Lots to say
> > >> > about it: not only the time lapse but the way the world is
> > >> > miniaturized. Here the real profilmic world is literally made into
> > >> > an stop motion animated “cartoon”. One could talk about the Quays
> > >> > work and time – both in terms of period and affect; rhythm and
> > >> > texture of their worlds (In Absentia, the film they made with
> > >> > Stockhausen, is in some ways about light/time, metaphorically
> > >> > written all at once over and over (the character n the film) hence
> > >> > no time. Endless time. Speed of light…  .) But I do not know what
> > >> > people have seen. I am more interested in hearing you all discuss
> > >> > temporality and animation “today”—both theoretically and
> examples.
> > >> > These discussions are so energetic. They amaze me.
> > >> >
> > >> > Thanks, Thyrza
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 12:39 AM, christopher sullivan
> > >> > <csulli at saic.edu> wrote:
> > >> > Hi Richard, I am the guy that wants animations about love, hate,
> > >> > birth, sex, and
> > >> > death.(not necessarily in that order)
> > >> > your rules of engagement leave me a little cold. why would this be
> > >> > a goal?
> > >> >
> > >> > "greatest possible distance between
> > >> >  human senses and computer code that is achievable through the
> > >> >  simplest material means"
> > >> >
> > >> > what part of the human condition would make this a mandate?
> > >> > why would this be effective, or rather effective at doing what?
> > >> > I know I am being a little aggressive here, but this is coming from
> > >> > someone who does not think Data means anything, nor does emulsion.
> > >> >
> > >> > chris.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > Christopher Sullivan
> > > Dept. of Film/Video/New Media
> > > School of the Art Institute of Chicago
> > > 112 so michigan
> > > Chicago Ill 60603
> > > csulli at saic.edu
> > > 312-345-3802
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > empyre forum
> > > empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
> > > http://www.subtle.net/empyre
> > >
> > 
> > 
> > Renate Ferro
> > Visiting Assistant Professor
> > Department of Art
> > Cornell University, Tjaden Hall
> > Ithaca, NY  14853
> > 
> > Email:   <rtf9 at cornell.edu>
> > Website:  http://www.renateferro.net
> > 
> > 
> > Co-moderator of _empyre soft skinned space
> > http://www.subtle.net/empyre
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empyre
> > 
> > Art Editor, diacritics
> > http://muse.jhu.edu/journals/dia/
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > empyre forum
> > empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
> > http://www.subtle.net/empyre
> > 
> 
> 
> Christopher Sullivan
> Dept. of Film/Video/New Media
> School of the Art Institute of Chicago
> 112 so michigan
> Chicago Ill 60603
> csulli at saic.edu
> 312-345-3802
> _______________________________________________
> empyre forum
> empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
> http://www.subtle.net/empyre
> 
> 
> 
>       


Christopher Sullivan
Dept. of Film/Video/New Media
School of the Art Institute of Chicago
112 so michigan
Chicago Ill 60603
csulli at saic.edu
312-345-3802

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