Re: [-empyre-] Pardon - En fran ç ais (sur Nietzsche)

[iarvers@free.fr]

Hi,

During my studies, what I preferred the most was cultural sociology, because it
deconstructs everything: religion, history, culture, and state power?

What I criticize is the ghetto of constructed tools that I must use if I want to
be part of the circle.

Marcus Winamps, social circles is really interesting for me in that sense. As
the book « the anarchist banker » of Fernando Pessoa. Every society is a social
fiction, you can change it by a revolution but you are going to construct a new
social fiction.

What could be the question is: who are the new clericals of our informational
age? And why is there such a separation between people, art world and
theoricians?

Where lies my freedom of thinking?

L?éternel retour:

I guess that my way of thinking comes from my personal experience when I was 8/9
years old, one of my brothers was student in a fine art school in Bordeaux and
he was also the assistant of Sol Lewitt for few months. Then, with my other
brother, they created ?Quais? a free newspaper dedicated to contemporary art. I
remember really well that time (80'), round discussions of galleries, artists,
speaking together, so happy to be the very happy few to be able to understand.
As a child, I felt that these discussions were very far from the real life, and
almost sounded like a foreign language to me.

I guess that my position is a reaction to that today, so Marc is right, there is
no zero ground. I am perhaps just from the generation who reacts towards a
certain conceptual art or to the modern conception of art, ?une vision
sacralisée de l?art? that creates a huge hole between art and the people.

My work as a curator or event organizer is only a question of feeling and
meetings, I just try to learn and understand the different technologies, the
influence of each technology on the aesthetic and then, I try to travel a lot
to meet as many artists and artworks as possible. Hopefully many things
happened in the underground or at the margins of white cubes!

I have a good example of what you said, Marc about net.art. In 2002 I launched a
net.art competition on the theme "audio games" for the first biennial Villette
Numérique. 20 artworks are still online. I was attacked on the main French
mailing lists because it wasn't pure net.art, according to the posts; it was a
shame to call it a net.art gallery, because there were web documentaries, VRML,
flash animations, games done in Director.

Which was ?true?, my background at that time was gizmoland (online from 2000 to
2001), a French portal dedicated to digital culture that was also a gallery of
digital artworks downloadable by pay per view (short films, games, screen
savers, interactive applications, fictions, moving images?)

Ok, not pure net.art as it has been defined. I understood the critics, I
Realized that I didn't know very well all this part of the web creation and a
month later, I was in Belgrade at Nikola Tosic's place on the road for turkey
for the event ?meet in a nice restaurant? and I discovered the book of Vuk
Cosic, netart per se. I decided that it could be a good idea to invite him to
Paris in order to listen to the true story of net.art, and I was surprised to
see that it was far away from the definition the French lists gave to me! But
still, we were talking about net.art as a ?dead? object, when only 2% of the
population knew what we were talking about.

Responding to Saul, you are absolutely right, it is not because something is new
that it is valuable, but again, isn?t it an alternative?

I would love to be very positive and to believe that our way of thinking is
going to enlarge itself, thanks to our modernist conception of the evolution.
That our consciousness is going to be more and more able to understand the
complexity of reality. But what I see is: reactionism, fear, closing instincts,
protectionism, and mysticism

we just repeat and repeat, and that?s why i think that working on the idea of
memory is so important.

And that?s also why I still believe that there is perhaps an alternative in
using other tools than the classics and that more access to entertainment would
perhaps avoid monsters.

yes alliette, of course we refuse/deny what we don't know, violence comes often
of a lack of symbolic power, it is also what gives birth to racism

and that's the problem for me, this huge separation between the little elitist
circle who knows and the big mass that remain in the deep darkness, who has an
interest to that?

isabelle
www.isabelle-arvers.com

Selon Aliette <aliette@criticalsecret.org>:

> En français -sur Nietzsche
>
> En tant que détermination héroïque chez Nietzsche l'éternel retour ne
> regarde pas la conception dépressive de l'éternel retour du temps (et de
> l'Histoire) chez Hegel...
>
> L'éternel retour dans "Ainsi parlait Zarathoustra" serait autant lié à une
> éthique élevée de la philosophie de Nietzsche qu'à sa représentation propre
> des cycles de la vie. Ce n'est pas de la croyance, ni un véritable système
> (même si le système de cycles nous en connaissons toutes sortes de sources
> et de références), mais un défi philosophique qui est lancé : peut-être la
> métaphore d'un outil sublime telle cette scène de l'élévation de l'homme,
> dans l'idée de ce qu'en conscience, à tout moment de sa vie, il doit faire
> ou ne pas faire, pour pouvoir imaginer possible, selon sa conscience et son
> émotion, ce retour dans sa destinée. Ce qui veut dire tout le contraire de
> la rémanence, mais pas le contraire de la projection ni du projet. Il n'y a
> pas de remord dans l'éternel retour de Nietzsche, ni de mélancholie, mais au
> contraire le désir existentiel du futur,
>
> comme transcendance vitale.
>
> Cette conception abstraite des cycles ne précise pas si les formes changent
> ou pas - en fait elles changent envers et contre le cycle (dans la théorie
> de Marx le changement advient par la révolution, ce qui fait contradiction,
> mais apparemment compatible par malentendu, avec la conception chrétienne du
> progrès unidirectionnel et linéaire de l'innovation vers le meilleur social
> (Dieu ou l'utopie étant l'inacessible et l'inimitable modèle).
>
> Quant à la conception du cylcle chez Nietzsche, des critiques ou
> épistémologues français* attribuent qu'elle viendrait davantage de Vico -
> que certains considèrent comme l'inventeur du matérialisme historique
> moderne, et qui conçoit le retour de la barbarie après la réalisation
> égalitaire des sociétés humaines  (théorie dans laquelle Marx a peut-être
> imaginé dialectiquement sa conception du "dépérissement de l'Etat")-, plutôt
> que directement de Pythagore, de Platon, ou des stoïciens, ou encore du
> retour de l'histoire chez Hegel - devenant la répétition de l'Histoire chez
> Marx, jusqu'à l'invention de la dictature du prolétariat comme solution
> protectionniste des peuples en révolution, contre le retour de répressions
> telles que venait d'en subir la Commune de Paris ; et comme le dépérissement
> de l'Etat mettrait fin à la dictature un jour ou l'autre pour laisser place
> à la réalisation parfaite du communisme, il n'y avait pas à s'inquiéter du
> moyen provisoirement contraire aux fins...)
>
> Mais dans la vision Hégelienne, au contraire, on pourrait voir la répétition
> de l'Art - à défaut de sa révolution. Peut-être que les artistes chinois
> caricaturent sciemment ou répètent par hasard les formes de la modernité
> occidentale qui leur ont été transmises. Mais peut-être pas.
>
> Enfin, j'avais déjà dit que la négation étant un moyen de définir ce qui ne
> pouvait être ni nommé ni affirmé faute d'être précisément connu, un peu
> comme en mathématiques des ensembles, en somme la négation n'était pas
> négative dans ce cas...
>
> Note
> * http://www.marxists.org/francais/lafargue/works/1909/00/laf_19090000c.htm
> La Méthode historique de Karl Marx/ 3
> Lois historiques de Vico
> (Paul Lafargue, anarchist becoming marxist and activist of the Commune,
> husband of Lara -Marx's daugther)
>
>
>
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