[-empyre-] FW: lob

Jennifer Flores Sternad jf at post.harvard.edu
Fri May 16 00:19:30 EST 2008 

Dear Moli,
 how do you see  discussions on labor and work as framed by the
concept of precarity compared with the  approach you took in
ExArgentina?  I'm thinking, for example, of the discourse developed
around ' fleeing from work to action'  or in your essay for
LaNormalidad when you talk about the normalization or precarity  (ie
poverty - (& i absolutely agree with you on the importance of marking
that difference)

 if precarity is meant to mark a departure from what is described as a
traditional working class subject and established modes of labor
organizing, then it seems to me that an important counterpoint  would
be unemployed workers' movements / piquetero movements...
but these strike me as very different . and organized around different demands.
I'd like to know what you think about this...?

besos,
jenny

On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 6:28 AM, Eduardo Molinari
<archivocaminante at yahoo.com.ar> wrote:
> Dear Brian, dear Cara,
> when I said that "precarity" is a central concept in argentina,
> I'm talking about POVERTY.
> We can't think that "precarity" have a good meaning in our societies (southamerican). Is a bad joke to think that without resources
> we will do our activities in a better way.
> Is a political hipocresy for me to talk in this way.
> This was for me the "dificult" part of Risler/Bergel "experience".
>
> I don't want to organize our real social troubles with this concept.
> We have poverty, not precarity.
>
> Precarity (in argentina) is part of the discursse of "flexibilization",
> totally in the line of the economical change of the 90.
>
> we are in danger (in the sense that we will be "lost in translation")
> if we use this word, because precarity for many young people in the G8 countries is a kind of stress, of emotional vibration when they feel
> not totally sure about their professional future.
>
> But for us is not stress, is not an "exception state".
>
> sorry, totally respect, but...
>
> eduardo
>
> Eduardo Molinari / Archivo Caminante
> Aramburu 880, Dto.1 (1640) Martínez
> Provincia de Buenos Aires – Argentina
> 0541 1 47 98 48 35
>
>
> --- El jue 15-may-08, brian whitener <iwaslike at hotmail.com> escribió:
>
>> De: brian whitener <iwaslike at hotmail.com>
>> Asunto: [-empyre-] FW: lob
>> Para: empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
>> Fecha: jueves, 15 de mayo de 2008, 4:06 am
>> >
>> > "You are true Cara!!! precarity and starvation
>> are central questions today.
>> > In argentina, post-industry don't mean nothing. We
>> didn't have NEVER a real national industry. Is
>> post-nothing.
>> > but then... your question is also our question."
>> >
>> > Precarity: a useful category in Latin America?
>> >
>> > there was an encurentro organized by Julia Risler and
>> Martin Bergel in BA
>> >
>> >
>> http://estrecho.indymedia.org/newswire/display/21374/index.php
>> >
>> > i'm not sure what came of it, but i heard the
>> experience was both interesting and dificult.
>> >
>> > brian
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> Date: Tue, 13 May 2008 17:50:47 -0700
>> >> From: archivocaminante at yahoo.com.ar
>> >> Subject: Re: [-empyre-] expanded (CB)
>> >> To: empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
>> >>
>> >> Wonderrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
>> >> fulllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll
>> >> maillllllllllllllllllllllllllllll.
>> >>
>> >> many images here dear Cara!
>> >> thank you very much.
>> >>
>> >> I have time today to read your words.
>> >>
>> >> pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs
>> >> pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs
>> >> pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs pigs
>> >>
>> >> great.
>> >> and thank you for Alberto Grecoooooooooooooooooo!
>> >>
>> >> un abrazo for Marc&Christina!
>> >>
>> >> Very important your commentary about migrations in
>> America.
>> >> Is really very important.
>> >> I was 8 months last year in germany.
>> >> strongs feelings there, and one of them was the
>> question about migration in argentina.
>> >> Catholic - Jewuis traditions are very strong
>> tradition in argentina, they are in the "heart"
>> of our mixed / mestiza society.
>> >> Black people was killed, as slaves or
>> "soldiers" during the war against Paraguay.
>> >>
>> >> I imagine that protestant / calvinist, also
>> paganismus is working in the migrations of North America.
>> >>
>> >> Because of all this "migrations" I like
>> very much to know more about pre-hispanic cultures in
>> America. Is a central part of my investigation with
>> artistic methods.
>> >>
>> >> Very good the images of insite05!!!!! I like this!
>> Thank you very much!
>> >>
>> >> The last part of your mail is a very good
>> devolution,
>> >> I can say
>> >> YES YES YES, "we" CAN identify
>> >> material conditions that need to be addressed
>> >> without representing other!
>> >>
>> >> Because we will present them together,
>> >> like the blood of Genova in your mail.
>> >> Those red material conditions(saddly)are present.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> For me is really a big challenge to identify these
>> "material conditions"
>> >> that have still a potence living or able to live.
>> >>
>> >> My Walking Archives / Archivo Caminante tries to
>> do this, not for putting them "in order", but to
>> transport.
>> >>
>> >> You are true Cara!!! precarity and starvation are
>> central questions today.
>> >> In argentina, post-industry don't mean
>> nothing. We didn't have NEVER a real national industry.
>> Is post-nothing.
>> >> but then... your question is also our question.
>> >>
>> >> eduardo
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Eduardo Molinari / Archivo Caminante
>> >> Aramburu 880, Dto.1 (1640) Martínez
>> >> Provincia de Buenos Aires – Argentina
>> >> 0541 1 47 98 48 35
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --- El dom 11-may-08, Jennifer Flores Sternad
>> escribió:
>> >>
>> >>> De: Jennifer Flores Sternad
>> >>> Asunto: [-empyre-] expanded (CB)
>> >>> Para: "soft_skinned_space"
>> >>> Fecha: domingo, 11 de mayo de 2008, 6:56 pm
>> >>> from cara baldwin
>> >>> (thank you, cara!)
>> >>>
>> >>> ------ Forwarded Message
>> >>> From: Cara Baldwin
>> >>> Date: Sat, 10 May 2008 13:07:09 -0700
>> >>> To: "moarquech at yahoo.com.mx,
>> soft_skinned_space"
>> >>> ,
>> >>>
>> >>> Subject: Re: [-empyre-] Re: expanded
>> >>>
>> >>> Conversation in an elevator, . looking at the
>> stains on
>> >>> wood :
>> >>>
>> >>> --Which is better? This, or doing this?
>> >>>
>> >>> --This.
>> >>>
>> >>> --Bring him to see or bring them to see?
>> >>>
>> >>> --Bring them to see.
>> >>>
>> >>> Alberto Greco, from Manifesto Vivo-Dito, 1963
>> >>>
>> >>> back in the 90's (can't write this
>> without using a
>> >>> crackly old man
>> >>> voice) i was saving barricades in my apartment
>> for a rainy
>> >>> day. i put
>> >>> them on either side of the bridges that
>> connected the city
>> >>> and they
>> >>> quietly disappeared. i changed my underwear in
>> public and
>> >>> told
>> >>> everyone i was ana mendieta. learned about
>> chicano cultural
>> >>> politics
>> >>> and activism. met collaborators and friends
>> marc herbst and
>> >>> christina
>> >>> ulke and began years of conversation about
>> anything we
>> >>> could imagine
>> >>> and do together. following seattle we found
>> ourselves
>> >>> spending the
>> >>> summer in L.A. working with folks setting up
>> an la
>> >>> indymedia for the
>> >>> 2000 democratic national convention.
>> representation.
>> >>> organization, and
>> >>> lot's and lot's of
>> >>>
>> >>> pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. p pigs. pigs.
>> pigs. pigs.
>> >>> pigs. pigs.
>> >>> pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs.
>> pigs. pigs. pigs.
>> >>> pigs.
>> >>> pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs. pigs.
>> pigs.
>> >>>
>> >>> brian holmes wrote about the "inflated
>> art scenes of
>> >>> the 90s" and that
>> >>> to "be an activist then was not
>> fashionable in any
>> >>> way, it was
>> >>> considered totally retrograde in artistic
>> circles."
>> >>> critique at this
>> >>> time lacked currency materially and culturally
>> (narrow
>> >>> sense of the
>> >>> word) from where i was standing. listening to
>> someone
>> >>> slather on about
>> >>> 68 and a postcolonial theorist's incisive
>> critique of
>> >>> metanarrative i
>> >>> wondered if the blood i'd seen in images
>> of the diaz
>> >>> school around
>> >>> genoa g8 was part of someone i loved.
>> >>>
>> http://www.nadir.org/nadir/initiativ/agp/free/genova/pics4a.htm
>> >>>
>> >>> adorno's "there is no love that is
>> not an
>> >>> echo." floating a desire to
>> >>> share the acoustic space in which we breath,
>> speak, feel
>> >>> and act in a
>> >>> way that is occupied and open—but not like a
>> yoga group.
>> >>>
>> >>> i also respond to eduardo molinari's
>> approach to the
>> >>> expanded,
>> >>> particularly considering migration patterns
>> across the
>> >>> americas and
>> >>> would only extend that history and migration
>> (not just
>> >>> recent. not
>> >>> just one way). grimson and kessler's on
>> argentina and
>> >>> the southern
>> >>> cone: neoliberalism and national imaginations,
>> and
>> >>> dunbar-ortiiz's
>> >>> roots of resistance speak to this in a
>> localized and
>> >>> concrete way.
>> >>>
>> >>> because of the relative economic stability in
>> north america
>> >>> during
>> >>> 2000 most of the art i saw produced/reproduced
>> in
>> >>> institutional
>> >>> contexts were either new media works of a post
>> modern or
>> >>> minimalist
>> >>> aesthetic or frothy blown out paintings meant
>> to illustrate
>> >>> 'networks
>> >>> and flows.' couldn't wait for
>> something to disrupt
>> >>> that. through the
>> >>> democratic national convention mobilizations
>> met sandra de
>> >>> la loza,
>> >>> working again with her, marc, christina and
>> ryan griffis
>> >>> and robby
>> >>> herbst on collectively organized and
>> community-based
>> >>> projects the 2004
>> >>> october surprise october surprise
>> >>> http://www.theoctobersurprise.org/
>> >>> and journal of aesthetics & protest
>> >>> http://www.joaap.org/ starting in
>> >>> 2001. the curator at the L.A. museum of
>> contemporary art
>> >>> who organized
>> >>> the experimental exercise of freedom (with
>> rina carvajal)
>> >>> needed an
>> >>> assistant— i was able to research and write
>> about artists
>> >>> from
>> >>> central, south america and italy if i held my
>> cards to my
>> >>> chest.
>> >>> actually, i was more like a child at the table
>> who would
>> >>> reemerge
>> >>> occasionally sticky with cobwebs. cards can
>> fit in your
>> >>> back pocket
>> >>> depending on who / where you are perceived to
>> be. the
>> >>> emphasis on
>> >>> institutional critique at california institute
>> of the arts
>> >>> was
>> >>> grounded even as it was too narrowly
>> circumscribed. met
>> >>> etcetera last
>> >>> october without a joint, sadly. first saw
>> their work in
>> >>> another
>> >>> institutional context at the centro cultural
>> de tijuana at
>> >>> inSITE
>> >>> 2005. bill kelly and sandra were there as
>> well. sunday
>> >>> morning as
>> >>> hurricane katrina wound toward new orleans
>> bill kelly,
>> >>> sandra and i
>> >>> sat the golden glow of the haudenschildGarage
>> listening to
>> >>> what i
>> >>> found fucked approaches to collectivity,
>> mobility and
>> >>> 'cultural'
>> >>> exchange. everyone was wearing white linen
>> except sandra
>> >>> and me who
>> >>> sat talking loudly shit (like children) in the
>> back.
>> >>>
>> http://www.insite05.org/internal.php?pid=17-357 women are
>> >>> among those
>> >>> compelled to learn early the many ways and to
>> what extent
>> >>> representation and invisibility are useful.
>> >>>
>> >>> can 'we' identify material conditions
>> that urgently
>> >>> need to be
>> >>> addressed w/out representing others? this is
>> an open
>> >>> question and one
>> >>> we work from and through every day. i'm on
>> an overpass
>> >>> with berries
>> >>> falling out of my mouth. precarity gives way
>> to starvation
>> >>> at some
>> >>> point and i would like to address that. the
>> black panther
>> >>> party
>> >>> breakfast program is art.
>> >>>
>> >>> in addition to 'post politics' what is
>> meant by
>> >>> 'post industrial' at
>> >>> this moment?
>> >>>
>> >>> sorry, I know I'm not following form
>> handing threads
>> >>> back in a tangled
>> >>> sticky ball.
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> empyre forum
>> >>> empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
>> >>> http://www.subtle.net/empyre
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Yahoo! Encuentros.
>> >>
>> >> Ahora encontrar pareja es mucho más fácil,
>> probá el nuevo Yahoo! Encuentros
>> http://yahoo.cupidovirtual.com/servlet/NewRegistration
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> empyre forum
>> >> empyre at lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
>> >> http://www.subtle.net/empyre
>> >
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>
>
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-- 
Jennifer Flores Sternad
303.204.0003 (m)
213.483.6050 (h)

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