[-empyre-] playing vs productivity (and what does it has to do with videogames?)

[Georg Russegger]

hello emypres!

my name is georg russegger from lthe european reseach group udic  
interfaces and a friend (mathias fuchs) pointed me to your discussion.
the mail from Rafael was the first dipp in  - sorry if i raise some  
questions which might be arleady
solved here:

Rafael wrote: "...on an evolutionary basis."
thanks for the brilliant start!

is dualism helpful: playing vs. productivity. (it might be just a  
catchy title)
wouldn't something linke "prdoductive playability" (i guess julian -  
hi from austria - runs a blog with this title)
give the perspective on where play has its productive moments?

>  high level social behaviour
would this be better off being  called playing or gameplay?
at least how i understand it: game is a framed, rulebased and inter-re- 
aktive set of possibilities but not the action-dimension itself.
if we talk ANT we can look hom much game fomentation there is in the  
game-deliniation already implied.

video game for starting is a type of game - is this list about  
videogaming - that would be pityful - because it is a higly complex  
field
where some observations are harder to make than in general gameplay  
sets.
i would rather take video games as examples but to do the whole  
discussion based on this wiould be rather probelmatic.


> are videogames (now) still games?

why not? - maybe the STILL is important to answer...
put please make a clear statement why videogames are so special in  
contrary to other games.

thank you
greetings
ge.org



On Nov 30, 2010, at 5:08 PM, Rafael Trindade wrote:

> Hey, folks,
>
> I am Rafael Trindade, and this is my first time at -empyre-. It's an  
> honor, and a pleasure to be invited to this month's debate. Thank you.
>
> On the functionality of playing: I do agree with Simon Biggs.  
> Playing is not aimless - or not essentially aimless. And we can  
> discuss it on an evolutionary basis. I'm not sure, though, if it's a  
> good idea to formulate the problem like this:
>
> > However, to sustain this argument it needs to be accepted that  
> high level
> > social behaviour is genetically inherited.
>
> At least, not while we are talking about videogames and videogame  
> cultures. It seems to me that the point is not which means should we  
> use to approach games in general; we're talking about some high  
> level social behaviour that happens to be called "games" (because  
> they really are, yes), but differentiate themselves from another  
> kinds of gaming not only because their mechanics and materiality,  
> but also because of the sociocultural systems which they belong to.
>
> I'm not saying that videogames are ontologically different from  
> other games (or are they? I don't know, maybe not), but sometimes I  
> feel that the functions they perform are not necessarily the same.  
> Even when I can relate one experience to another (arcades/gambling  
> houses; "casual" games/crosswords and such; pokémon/cockfights;  
> level-oriented games/tabletop RPGs, collections and everything OCD),  
> I feel that
> maybe it's different. But I really don't know, I have never thought   
> seriously about that.
>
> When they are competing in arcades or tournaments, players do want  
> to win over their colleagues, but I sense that it's not about the  
> competition. It's not even about bragging. It's about winning, in  
> order to stay within the experience; to keep the thing going on. Of  
> course it is cool to be the best, of course it's pretty ok to gain  
> some respect; but people would go to arcades even if they are  
> emptied out, just to enjoy their games; one cannot say the same  
> about spitting contests and the like. It's not ontologically about  
> the competition.
>
> It's already known that plot it's not an essential element of  
> videogaming, one of the reasons given being the impatience shown by  
> players at dialogues in arcades. I remember now a similar fact -  
> that no one cares about Hall of Fame status. All the arcades  
> champions are named AAA.
>
> But I'm not sure, maybe there are similar situations outside  
> videogaming.
>
> I just wish to highlight Gabriel Menotti's question: are videogames  
> (now) still games?
>
>
> Thanks, and regards,
> Rafael.
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