[-empyre-] SECOND WEEK GRAB EM BY THE PUISSANCE empyre Digest, Vol 143, Issue 8

[Murat Nemet-Nejat]

Alan,

"... In other for me - when you say "If rules of language are analogous to
the rules of games; ie if saying something in language is analogous to
making a move in a game, (each with its own codes, grammar, relations,
contexts), and though we never fully know the rules of the game, we are
always learning, internalizing, and becoming intimate with a massive,
multipart, global algorithm, discovering is ALLEGO?RHYTHMS; simultaneously
learning and unlearning the systems, the codes...."

There are no rules, we assume there are rules, as we assume there is
intelligent design.  It language is a game, in that game we the humans are
the pawns-- and the wind that blows is the player.

Ciao,
Murat

On Thu, Nov 10, 2016 at 7:44 PM, Alan Sondheim <sondheim at panix.com> wrote:

> ----------empyre- soft-skinned space----------------------
>
> But I wonder if there are games, in fact, in the first place. Yes, W's
> language games - but there's also Paul Goodman's writings for example on
> the sloppiness of these. And language games aren't games - W's sloppy here
> himself. The point of my own writing is that language games aren't games at
> all; they're semiotic splatter, temporary autonomous communalities that
> always tend to fray, fall apart; I remember - I think it was Maturano -
> talking about language as the mutual orienting of cognitive domains - which
> doesn't mean that the domains are commensurate, only that a certain amount
> of agreement has been reached. The problem also with multiplicity which we
> all love and embrace - is that on another level Trump does exactly the same
> - changing the rules constantly, avoiding any kind of pinning down - ask
> about his taxes and he talks about rigged elections; pin him down on those
> and he talks about the media; pin him on the media and he talks about
> purges and the 'devastating' emails; talk about the emails and he talks
> about throwing her in jail. Gamespace can be a disaster; look at Hitler's
> programs, the interiors and exteriors of his discourses, etc. etc.
>
> In other for me - when you say "If rules of language are analogous to the
> rules of games; ie if saying something in language is analogous to making a
> move in a game, (each with its own codes, grammar, relations, contexts),
> and though we never fully know the rules of the game, we are always
> learning, internalizing, and becoming intimate with a massive, multipart,
> global algorithm, discovering is ALLEGO?RHYTHMS; simultaneously learning
> and unlearning the systems, the codes." - I say this "If" contains serious
> problems, the potential for play, yes, on one hand, but also for absolutism
> on the other. And for me, for that matter, the codes are never fixed, you
> can't learn them, you can't become intimate with the global algorithm - if
> we could, one of the first things I'd want to do is learn about database
> hardening against Assange and company's release of emails - ever so slowly,
> over a period of months, ultimate bringing HRC down (with the aid of the
> FBI's shell game).
>
> In other words - suppose language isn't play, but might be the most
> serious thing in the world, a matter of life and death, as well. And in
> that sense perhaps not a game at all, but a proto-language, ruleless,
> desperate, uncomfortable tied to existence itself?
>
> (I love your writing btw; I've been moving more in an other direction -
> for a lot of reasons having to do with disaster.)
>
> - Alan
>
>
> On Thu, 10 Nov 2016, Adeena Karasick wrote:
>
> ----------empyre- soft-skinned space----------------------
>>
>
> ==
> email archive http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/
> web http://www.alansondheim.org / cell 718-813-3285
> music: http://www.espdisk.com/alansondheim/
> current text http://www.alansondheim.org/ug.txt
> ==
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